Zidane's headbutt was excellent. what a way to end a career!

Well. Look on the bright side: you don't have cancer any more! Fucking bandwagon Lebanese driving about honking their horns, grr.

Ah fuck off. Bloody fuck.

Zidane lives up to his thuggish reputation. Way to go off the world cup. Italia won!

L- you should drop this 'italian acting' talk. How many times did Ribery dive in that game alone? Not to mention the undeserved penalty. Drop it before you come off as a sore loser.

I really liked Trezeguet, too bad he had to miss.

As a typical American, I don't generally have a lot invested in soccer. But I have been following the World Cup and I was definitely rooting for France in this one and Zidane in particular. Always like supporting the overachieving underdogs with the gutsy older star set to retire.

But damn, that was one vicious hit. Not to mention at just about the most incredibly stupid time imaginable. I mean no doubt the other guy was cheerfully nattering on about how he fucked Zidane's mother last night, but still. Me and my friends were kind of stupefied.

Well pity, but I don't really care either way.

At least my neighbourhood will finally return to normal. Tired of idiot French/Italian/Portuguese suburbanites descending on it like a flock of mad seagulls.

ya abu l-maal,

entirely, absolutely, totally agree with you.

putain de merde.

well ... and the football oscar goes to ... the best ... ACTRESSES!!!

but in the end it was the french who didn't manage to score a goal in 60 minutes over being the dominating team (even after zidane's red card) - and it was zidane who FUCKED UP. what a fucking idiot.

oh well ... free pizza & pasta for a week.

--raf*

Ali

As we say in the Maghreb, sir fi halek.

Maccheroni for everyone.

Yeah, Zidane fucked up big time. Even if NYT is correct in reporting the Italian fucked with him, he was a pure and total idiot over-reacting like that.

Stupid froggies, dominate for bloody 60 odd minutes or more, and still don't hit one home.

And Zidane, oulid asharmatite.

Un-fucking-believable, that Zidane. It was such a stupid time and a stupid way to get sent off that I almost wondered if Berlusconi had fixed it. And all the roaring Italian-Americans who have suddenly discovered their Italianness and are running around screaming "Italia italia" in bars, puhhlease.

well, at least now with the world cup over, aqoul authors will finally get back to writing interesting things and my football-inclined coworkers will start pulling their weight again.

i really wonder what the italians said to Zidane to piss him off so much. musta been quite good!

dear all,

it's just a hunch ... but my instinct says it was either something derogatory about arabs or muslims.

i have absolutely no information on which i base this - i know nothing about mazerrati at all - so it's really just based on what it possibly could've been. no football player of that caliber like zizou goes ballistic if someone just insults his mom ...

so ... if i'm right - remember where you read it first!

--raf*

"but my instinct says it was either something derogatory about arabs or muslims"

It probably wasn't anything abour arabs, since he's not an arab. Maybe Materazzi called him a harki.

Despite his usually smiling and controlled public persona, Zidane has a history of this sort of thing. From a Guardian article on Zidane,

"One of the theories about Zidane as a player is that he is driven by an inner rage. His football is elegant and masterful, charged with technique and vision. But he can still erupt into shocking violence that is as sudden as it is inexplicable. The most famous examples of this include head butting Jochen Kientz of Hamburg during a Champions League match, when he was at Juventus in 2000 (an action that cost him a five match suspension) and his stomping on the hapless Faoud Amin of Saudi Arabia during the 1998 World Cup finals (this latter action was, strangely enough, widely applauded in the Berber community as Zidane's revenge on hated Arab 'extremists')."

It is sad though, that, in literally the final moments of his career, he's allowed this violent streak to define him.

All in all a very boring world cup. Only a couple of good matches. I think there is something wrong in a world cup where a team like Ukraine can cruise to the quarter finals based mainly on luck, whereas Ghana and Cote d'Ivoire get pounded down because of their draw. They need to do something about these 'groups of death'.

Raf-
It could be something like that, but Zidane has a history of violence. Do you remember him mauling that poor saudi?

This is like watching a bunch of women dissect an episode of All My Children the next day.

Really, gentlemen.

come now, e!

take some of that T3 and join us!

you should be damn glad this thing only happens once every four years instead of every week-day (ala all my children).

what is this ... All my Children you speak of?

I have nothing to contribute, save my pointless objectification of Zidane and some hot Portuguese player whose name escapes me.

E: it's hardly pointless. i dont particularly like tennis but i still occasionally watch to see the likes of Anna Kournikova. your contributions are completely legitimate, E.

The French dived a great deal more than the Italians this game...and got a penalty for their trouble. No sympathy from me. Forza Italia.

A very entertaining final, as finals go. Didn't expect that at all. Curious, though, that the Italians got tired before the old boys French team.

E- That would probably be C. Ronaldo, on the Portugueuse team.

Zidane... I was too surprised to even react. Henry being subbed when a shootout was coming was unfortunate too. An incredible match though, except for the shootout ending.

e, you're looking for "Cristiano Ronaldo"

But I have no idea what Zidane could have been thinking, and, well, whatever happened, Materazzi found his number.

I almost feel badly having cheered for the Italians, for it to have ended that way.

... oh, and the result, I was rooting for France. Italy might have won some respect from me with an amazing win, but sadly a shootout doesn't qualify.

Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret!

YAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAYYYYYYYYYYYYYY

Anon, I know many Berbers who hate Zidane precisely for his stomping on that KSA player back in 98.

Actually, I hate soccer. I don't give a damn about Italia winning.

But sorry L, this tastes so good, so I'll have another shot:

Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret! Fransa khasret!

But he can still erupt into shocking violence that is as sudden as it is inexplicable.

Typical of the ghetto scum that he is.

Ah bollocks.

Don't really agree about this WC being short on quality - a handful of very intensive games in the knock-out stage, a brilliant semi-final between Germany and Italy, and brilliant individualities such as Cristiano Ronaldo (never mind his diving), Buffon, Pirlo, Ribéry, Cannavaro, Riquelme, Sagnol, Lahm, Odonkor - and in his own peculiar way Gattuso - and the incredible goal by Cambiasso against Serbia-Montenegro...

As the overwhelming majority here in Morocco, I supported Italy, and I have had the added incentive of having or dozen or so overbearing and arrogant French colleagues. The revival the last few days of the delusive talk about "black-blanc-beur" in one of the most segregated countries in Western Europe will hopefully return to where it belongs - the dustbin of history. I never supported the French anyway - I must have been the only non-German to support Germany against France in the 1982 semi-final, and most certainly the only Arab to be glad when they lost at home to Israel in the qualifiers for the 1994 WC...

Now I can agree with Ibn Kafka, although even me frog hating JV partner decided to go for France.

The revival the last few days of the delusive talk about "black-blanc-beur" in one of the most segregated countries in Western Europe will hopefully return to where it belongs - the dustbin of history.

Well, had it included the least recognition of French ills, the reality of segregation and active racism in the French job markets.....

But of course it did not.

Nothing to add, except that it was stellar entertainment for a know-nothing about soccer like me. Unfortunately, at the insistence of the vast majority (on vacation in the vast South of the US), we wound up watching the last couple of games in English, when it would have been absolutely galactic entertainment had we stuck to the Mexicans. Oh well...

dear anon. et al-

i highly doubt that materazzi has an idea of (a) what a berber is & (b) that zidane is one & (c) that that would matter. hence - if materazzi did, indeed, say something racist-ish ... then the content was either arab- or islam-related.

as i said - 'tis nothing but a hunch.

and yes, i am aware of zidane's violent past.

--raf*

dear all,

the latest rumor has it that materazzi called zidane a "terrorist" ... god, i'm GOOD.

--raf*

Raf-
It doesn't have to be about arabs or muslims. It could be about africans. There are a lot of rumours going around. What I heard is that he either called him a dirty african or what L called him earlier.

ya ali,

even "dirty african" is in the category of ethnic slurs, as is anything islamophobic.

so much for that "football against racism" oath that all teams took over & over & over again during the cup ...

--raf*

Here's what BBC had to say:

"Sources in France say it is believed Materazzi insulted Zidane's mother.

Materazzi himself has not spoken publicly about the incident except to deny a claim by Paris-based anti-racism group SOS Racism, made on Monday, that he had called Zidane "a dirty terrorist".

"It is absolutely not true, I did not call him a terrorist. I'm ignorant. I don't even know what the word means," the Italian news agency Ansa quoted Materazzi as saying after the Italian team returned to Rome. "

Methinks Materazzi doth protest too much...he also got his father to talk to the press about how his darling sonny boy was the injured party, not the reverse. Pathetic - as a good Italian man he couldn't have got his Mamma to stand up for him?

Raf,

Zidane is Kabyle. That's probably the only Berber people who has a majority which makes a clear distinction between being Arab and being Berber.

I have no idea about Zidane's sensitivities. I know his father expressed outrage for being called a Harki several times by French journalists (many French tend to confuse Harki and Kabyle). At the same time, Zidane chose to completely assimilate (he has Catholic kids).

So you might be right. Or he might just be acting according to the civilized behavior that stereotypes the cités he comes from.

Daniel Davies has an appreciation of the headbutt, which is on youtube here

Sources in France say it is believed Materazzi insulted Zidane's mother

That to me seems more likely than ethnic/religious slurs. Insult a cité scum's mother and you'll see him react like a monkey. Like Zidane that is.

"That to me seems more likely than ethnic/religious slurs. Insult a cité scum's mother and you'll see him react like a monkey. Like Zidane that is."

Be careful, L.

ya shaheen,

if zidane would headbutt anyone calling him "son of a whore" ... he'd never make at much beyond the middle line ...

calling someone "ibn sharmuta" (or, in this case, "oulid asharmatite") on the pitch is like saying "dude, what's up?" ...

materazzi might be not an intellectual but today, in europe, in italy, EVERYone knows what the word "terrorist" means and what it means if one calls a north-african a "terrorist". as i said earlier, few people know that there are ANY non-arabs in north-africa, so i don't expect materazzi to know it.

as for "Insult a cité scum's mother and you'll see him react like a monkey." - ha, you've never BEEN in a ghetto. "kussummak" is a GREETING in these areas.

to me it seems that the italians might've been harrassing him for 80 minutes in order to affect his game ... as is normal in a game - psychological warfare is as important as physical fight - ... and at some point materazzi succeeded to make zidane do the stupidest thing he could've done - commit a foul that would get him kicked off the pitch.

--raf*

Leaving aside the pointless bickering over the provocation (I don't believe anyone seriously doubts the Italians were playing dirty pool, it being their habit), I loved this (from the above cited Guardian site):
I am sure that Materazzi would agree with this assessment; perhaps for the first time in his life, he was left flying through the air and falling over because of actually being hit.

Kha.

According to a reliable source, this is what went on:

Zidane: Let go of my shirt.
Materazzi: What? This is what you deserve.
Z: Yeah right. *moves away*
M: This is what you all deserve you fucking muslims. Bloody terrorists.
Z: Motherfucker. *headbutt*

Materazzi's claim of not knowing what a terrorist means is as close to a confession as you can get.

Raf,

few people know that there are ANY non-arabs in north-africa

True. I was just pointing out that Zidane was indeed a Berber, a Kabyle to be more precise. Relative to your point though, it's also true that if you insult a Kabyle with an anti-arab slur, he will either have any of the same possible reactions as an Arab, or go on explaining how he's actually not an Arab.

ha, you've never BEEN in a ghetto. "kussummak" is a GREETING in these areas

And anti-arab slurs are part of life in France too. Actually, unless you live in a remote village, it's a bit hard to live in France and not know the ghettos. But you have a point, and to be more accurate, I'd say that it all depends on the tone of "kussummak".

In any case, whatever was said and got on Zidane nerves, he just reacted like the stereotype of a ghetto scum. And nothing, absolutely nothing justifies that.

According to Lilian Thuram, a team mate of Zidane's, the slur had nothing ethnic about it (source: today's L'Equipe, the French sports daily). And Lilian Thuram is probably the only politcised player in the French team, having denounced Parliament's dim-witted attempt to rehabilitate colonisation as well as attacking Interior minister Sarkozy for his law-and-order rhetoric.

The same paper reported that the exchange went something like this: after Materazzi tugged at Zidane's shirt, Zidane told him, somewhat arrogantly, "I'll give it to you after game", to which Materazzi would have retorted "I'd rather have your wife's shirt", with some added comments on her sexuality...

Zidane is due to give his comments about the affair in a matter of days...

Looks like Raf was wrong.

http://www.iol.co.za/index.php?click_id=19&art_id=iol115272613812Z350&set_id=

kussummak, would that be like blacks calling each other niggers?

That Materazzi scum makes me sick with his jealousy of Zidane and his dispicable comments, I love Zidane as a classy world renowned footie player and believe he was in the right because if that was me I would have stamped on materazzi's privates as well and possibly a kick to the head

dear anon 07:33,

zidane said that materazzi had insulted his mom & sister - to me "you son of a terrorist whore" is an insult to one's mother. one can be insulting to a person's family AND do it in a racist way.

well ... now the courts are involved ... and i'm sure we'll find out just exactly what materazzi had said.

--raf*

Holy shit, get over it already!

This reminds me of that inane "Is it Farsi or is it Persian?" argument on the Syriana review.

ya malikat 'aqoul,

in this case ... the world cup itself is at stake.

1 - if the insult was racist, italy could be stripped of the title.

2 - if the 4th referee used video playback to determine zidane's headbutt, the game could be annuled. in that case the game would have to be repeated or there would not be a world cup winner this time.

frankly, i don't think anything WILL happen. i should enjoy the "free pizza & pasta" offer at my favorite italian restaurant, though.

--raf*

Klaus

kussummak litteraly is your mama's pussy. To use like in "fuck you", but with more care (using it against some athletic 2x1m 100kg scarface gentleman whose sight inspires respect can be unhealthy).

Ora ho 4 anni di tempo per tirarmela di fronte al mondo.
E comincio così. In ritardo.

Perchè è vero, i Tedeschi hanno ragione, siamo dei PARASSITI. Ed hanno ragione anche i cugini Francesi, siamo MAFIOSI. Siamo Italiani, nel bene e nel male.

Però, quanto meno:
- non abbiamo nomi da froci come TIERRI', FRANSUA', ANTUAN.
- non abbiamo impronunciabili nomi da nazista come LOTAR, GUNDAM, CRASFGRANDAR.
- non abbiamo baffi biondi da tamarro.
- non portiamo il pane sotto le ascelle mentre camminiamo . perchè non è igienico.
- non mettiamo i sandali con le calze ....... perchè fanno cagare.
- la nostra cucina non sarà "NUVELL", ma almeno le porzioni sono umane, e non da canarini.

- anche noi abbiamo buon vino e buona birra, ma non scassiamo le palle al mondo sostenendo che siano i migliori.
- non abbiamo i coprivolante delle macchine in peluche.
- saremo anche PARASSITI, ma ogni estate non occupiamo la Toscana o la riviera Romagnola pretendendo di trovare Wurstel e Crauti in spiaggia o i cartelli stradali bilingue
- le nostre donne (nella maggior parte dei casi) non hanno acconciature tardo-anniottanta o ossigenature paurose da pornodive,

da noi la permanente è oramai fuorilegge, così come gli slip ascellari.
- i nostri giocatori sputano, è vero, sfottono, è vero, giocano duro, è vero.

Però non tirano testate, e se lo fanno a nessuno viene in mente di premiarli come migliori giocatori di un torneo.
- se uno dei nostri giocatori prende 5 giornate di squalifica per una gomitata, non gridiamo allo scandalo, anche se la televisione che lo ha ripreso non è ufficiale. Al limite uno tira una bestemmia, ed è finita lì.
- non ce la tiriamo con tutto il mondo per una funnydream (!) di torre di ferraglia rugginosa.
- quando un Italiano va in un altro paese, tempo sei mesi e impara la lingua. Quando un fottuto Tedesco viene in Italia, e mangia in Italia, e guida una Ferrari (macchina italiana) per sei anni, impara l'Inglese (!). Platini, LE RUA', era sì Francese, ma giocava in italia.

Zidane, L'IMPERATUR, è si Francese, ma è esploso in Italia.

Thierry ha giocato in Italia,

Vieira pure.

La domanda è: c'è qualche funnydream (!) di Francese che è capace di imparare a giocare a calcio senza venire in Italia?

Quando noi perdiamo ai rigori si chiama SFIGA. Quando vinciamo si chiama VENDETTA............ ed ha un sapore buonissimo.

- Saremo anche un paese diviso, ma non eravamo noi ad avere un muro, e non abbiamo Magrebini, Algerini e Tunisini finti-Francesi che ad ogni occasione sfasciano vetrine e incendiano le Città.

- la pizza è nostra. E' buonissima e ce la invidia tutto il mondo.
- L'OMELETTE è solo una funnydream (!) di frittata.
- vuoi mettere un wurstel con una soppressata Calabra?!

Potrei andare avanti all'infinito.
Le differenze socio-culturali sono moltissime.
Anzi, direi che come giocano potremmo inventarne sempre di nuove (aggiungendole alla lista).

Ma per adesso va bene così........... è solo l'inizio.
Abbiamo altri 4 anni per fare quello in cui noi Italiani siamo davvero e senza ombra di dubbio gli indiscussi Campioni del
Mondo:

PRENDERE PER IL CUL0!!!!

dear all,

and for everything else, there is:

http://www.google.com/translate_t

--raf*

Don't mind him. He's still upset about the Der Spiegel thing. There is much in what you say, J, but your beer isn't that great.

1 - if the insult was racist, italy could be stripped of the title.

2 - if the 4th referee used video playback to determine zidane's headbutt, the game could be annuled. in that case the game would have to be repeated or there would not be a world cup winner this time.

Now we descend into Gallic buffoonery -- and you're not even French! AFAIK, not even the French fantasize that Italy might be stripped of the title if Materazzi said something racist.

Far more interesting than what Zidane actually did is the French reaction to it. The day before Zidane gave his explanation, 61 percent of the French forgave Zidane and 52 percent understood why he did it. Filing a lawsuit on the theory that the linesman didn't see something that 2 billion other people did is not exactly the best way to cover yourself with national glory.

On a lighter, and completely unrelated, note, the U.S. Department of Homeland Security believes that terrorists hate kangaroos.

http://blogs.usatoday.com/ondeadline/2006/07/do_terrorists_h.html

Well, both kangaroos and the Amish are symbols of corrupt Western decadence, promiscuity, godlessness, capitalism, imperialism, etc.

One of these days, Lazy Scum Anon, I'm going to get you to write for something for us.

J- Thanks for letting me brush up on my italian, but what the hell is 'funnydream'?

"Quando un fottuto Tedesco viene in Italia, e mangia in Italia, e guida una Ferrari (macchina italiana) per sei anni, impara l'Inglese (!)."

I wonder what you would think of the English who won't bother to learn anything at all.

dear lazy anon scum,

how fifa reacts to this will determine the situation for the next 5-8 years.

it has to do with the role of video playback during the game, how insults are treated, about that oh-so-cherished new anti-racism rule & the oath ... etc.

so ... it's not exactly nitpicking.

i agree with your take on the french reaction to zidane. and that red card was perfectly justified.

i just think that - for the sake of the game - it should be established just what exactly materazzi has said, so that fifa can deal with it according to the rules and there won't be any conspiracy theories and bad blood about the "stolen world cup" etc.

cheers,

--raf*

Re the USA today arty/post (and the NYT arty on the same subject yesterday), I have to say that this rather underlines my sense that the American reaction to "terror threats" has been dominated by utterly irrational idiocy.

The NYT arty rather had me wondering at the sanity of the PR people at the American Homeland Security (sic) agency; defending it was not a good idea. "Look into" and the like is the proper response to a bungle coming to light.

Italy could be stripped of the World Cup because FIFA rules enacted in March this year say that in matches without points, racist insults disqualify the team.

See

http://www.republic-news.org/archive/142-repub/142_italy_stripped_world_cup.htm

for the fuller article.

As a coda to all this, I see that FIFA has sanctioned both of them. Zidane got a $6000 fine and a three-game suspension for the head-butt and Materazzi got a $4000 fine and a two-game suspension for "being mean."

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/07/20/AR2006072000177.html

Soccer players might be in great physical shape but they are the biggest bunch of whimps on the planet. There are middle-school ballet troops that are tougher than these people. It's bad enough that they get knocked over and, apparently, severely injured by passing winds, now they're going to be running to the ref in tears because somebody said a bad word. I know that soccer players haven't got the fortitude of rugby players, but it would be nice if they at least had the fortitude of grade school dodge-ball players.